If you could have a outpost your way what would you want it to look like?

joecool wrote:

Claymore wrote: “Ignore your troops, and they’ll go away.”

Post-Marsh, how many men would have stepped in to try and fix Royal Rangers? Not me. I'm not a glutton for punishment. I appreciate that someone did, but there was just so much to fix, it was likely overwhelming. No doubt, some of the fluff from that era was never going to be allowed to go away, due to the amount of financial investment in it. Yet, that has cost us a whole lot more, year after year. Why keep adding layers of paint when you haven't dealt with the underlying corrosion?

I think it's in the revitalized 9-year old thread, but someone said that we need to go back to what worked. Johnnie Barnes' creation was nothing short of anointed brilliance. Now we have waaaaaaaaay too many administrative layers, adult medals, training courses, books and more. KISS. Keep It Simple and Sensible.

My LMA courses and instructors were awesome and inspired me to 30 years of RR service. I'd love to do another decade. But the District's RR command structure is long gone. And it appears that pastors have moved on. How to get them back onboard?    

Claymore wrote: Now was this, alone, the factor that pushed Rangers over the cliff?  No, but it was one more unnecessary problem that could have been avoided, with a little bit of wisdom, foresight, and humility.......and listening to your front-line leaders.

Claymore wrote:
He successfully drove off much of the talent of the Level I Leaders in the Program.

A few years ago, I called a National Muzzleloading Instructor to set up certification training.  When I told him that it was for a Royal Ranger Outpost, he said, "Royal Rangers.  Oh yeah, I used to be a Royal Rangers Commander.  I could handle the changes under Mariott, but not this current fella (Doug Marsh).".

ccm2361 wrote: Those of us who weren't blind, were called "worldly commanders" & "against kids getting closer to God" & other things.

ccm2361 wrote: I should add for those that do not know. I did not get off the Rangers bus because of Doug Marsh. I am out because we were shut down by our pastor.

ccm2361 wrote:

ccm2361 wrote: Those of us who weren't blind, were called "worldly commanders" & "against kids getting closer to God" & other things.

Many of the loudest cheerleaders of Doug Marsh's "spirit led" vision for Rangers are still there at the highest levels of the program. They are just as guitly as Doug Marsh in my eyes. They did his bidding & suppressed any dissent. Yet, they know Doug Marsh was a disaster for Royal Rangers. But will they admit it?  
Most of them should be relieved of their positions for lack of discernment. Some of them did unethical things & 1 or 2 even did illegal things to suppress dissent.

It still kind of burns my biscuits, even after 10 years.


I should add for those that do not know. I did not get off the Rangers bus because of Doug Marsh. I am out because we were shut down by our pastor.

ccm2361 wrote:

A lot of folks were initially blind to it. Those of us who weren't blind, were called "worldly commanders" & "against kids getting closer to God" & other things. We just needed to get on board or get off the bus.

joecool wrote: I sense that you would jump back in if the opportunity presented itself. Otherwise, why would you still be on Ranger Chat?

Claymore wrote:[
Chris,

First of all, I did not know that your pastor shut down the Program.  You had mentioned how attendance was dwindling, and I had assumed that with lack of attendance and the increasing demands of your job, that the program just shriveled up.

Second thanks, you make me feel better about myself.  I had thought that I may have been a bit rough in my criticism, but when I saw Chris (who doesn't have a mean bone in his body) be just as critical, it kind-of gave me a warm-fuzzy feeling about myself.

It is very interesting to note that, if the folks running the original Royal Rangers Forum had been a bit more honest and open-minded, you & Dan might not have seen the need for developing Ranger Chat.  Now we may not be quite as big and healthy as we once were, but at least, we haven't been Dead for twelve years, like the other one.

ccm2361 wrote:

joecool wrote: I sense that you would jump back in if the opportunity presented itself. Otherwise, why would you still be on Ranger Chat?

I would get back in for sure. There is an outpost 20 minutes away. But to join them would be missing Wednesday night service at my own church. Being a Deacon at my church, going to another church every Wednesday night might not look the best.


As for why do I stick around here? I am the Administrator. I have to stick around or no one is runing the show.

RRCmdrBennett wrote:

ccm2361 wrote:

joecool wrote: I sense that you would jump back in if the opportunity presented itself. Otherwise, why would you still be on Ranger Chat?

I would get back in for sure. There is an outpost 20 minutes away. But to join them would be missing Wednesday night service at my own church. Being a Deacon at my church, going to another church every Wednesday night might not look the best.


As for why do I stick around here? I am the Administrator. I have to stick around or no one is running the show.

In my original outpost in the Potomac district in Baltimore we had a deacon from a neighboring A/G church do Wednesday nights with us but attend his own church on Sundays.

Claymore wrote:

I am going to have to agree with Dan, again (Lord, take me now...).

Claymore wrote: Look, if you have a heart for the Lord and for boys and for working with Rangers, then you are wasting the talents that God has given you, unless you have a REALLY good excuse (and I do not consider avoiding disappointing the Pastor as being such).

Claymore wrote:

RRCmdrBennett wrote:

ccm2361 wrote:

joecool wrote: I sense that you would jump back in if the opportunity presented itself. Otherwise, why would you still be on Ranger Chat?

I would get back in for sure. There is an outpost 20 minutes away. But to join them would be missing Wednesday night service at my own church. Being a Deacon at my church, going to another church every Wednesday night might not look the best.


As for why do I stick around here? I am the Administrator. I have to stick around or no one is running the show.

In my original outpost in the Potomac district in Baltimore we had a deacon from a neighboring A/G church do Wednesday nights with us but attend his own church on Sundays.

.

CHRIS,

I am going to have to agree with Dan, again (Lord, take me now...).

Look, if you have a heart for the Lord and for boys and for working with Rangers, then you are wasting the talents that God has given you, unless you have a REALLY good excuse (and I do not consider avoiding disappointing the Pastor as being such).

You ran an outpost for years.  You understand the Program, and you know when to go along with the current from Springfield and when to swim cross-current.  No amount of money can take the place of the knowledge that you have gained.

When you are standing before the Lord, and he asks what you did with that time and very special talent and experience that he gave to you, and how many boys you helped with it, do you want to say, "Well, none after 2019, but I kept my pastor happy..."?.

A GOOD pastor should understand that if you have a calling for a mission field, especially with young people, that he should be prepared to make accommodations for it.  Let him know that you'll be more than happy to keep your talent "at home" if the church comes up with the kids.  

It should be like if you had a talent for helping people through Teen Challenge or Celebrate Recovery.  Are you going to deny them your help, just because they are across Town, and not walking into your church?

Maybe that will put a flame under your pastor to get more families with kids.  Would it work out to take other kids from your church to the place with R/R meetings (this might draw more families with kids to your church and increase Wednesdays and Sundays).  

Here at our church, a man who was the captain of the Greeting Team and was the lead male singer in our Worship Team left our church, about 3 weeks ago, because our church didn't have a Youth Group for his girls.  I don't hold it against him.  Those girls are the center of his universe, and he wants them to enjoy going to church, so he went to a place that has a great Youth Group.

If you are putting in extra time and work to help kids, whether at home or across Town, it is a good thing.  The pastor may have been given authority, but that authority is only as much as the congregation gives to him.  And do you know what I call someone whose wages are paid out of my pocket?  An employee.

Claymore wrote:
Look, if you have a heart for the Lord and for boys and for working with Rangers, then you are wasting the talents that God has given you, unless you have a REALLY good excuse (and I do not consider avoiding disappointing the Pastor as being such).  

ccm2361 wrote: I asked for 2 signs. If I see them, then I will know that  
is where He wants me.