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Helwan Brigadier 9mm

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Helwan Brigadier 9mm

Post by RRCmdrBennett on March 31st 2014, 10:50 pm

A coworker got this Helwan Brigadier 9mm from his dad. Best I can determine its aBeretta  knock-off. Anyone know the quality of this gun?

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Re: Helwan Brigadier 9mm

Post by Claymore on April 1st 2014, 12:06 am

You're right. It was licensed by Beretta as a Pre-Model 92 Design.

Design is good, but I've heard that the Metal & Workmanship Quality are Lackluster.

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Re: Helwan Brigadier 9mm

Post by RRCmdrBennett on April 1st 2014, 1:48 am

Safe to shoot or no?

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RR Outpost #215, Ohio District :flag:
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"Be Ready, It wasn't raining when Noah built the Ark."

fire FCF Frontiersman 9/91 fire
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LTC LMA 5/94, Ranger Basics 1/05, LTA LMA 5/05, NTC IL 5/09, WCO 10/09, ICS 4/10, RKTC 7/10, Ranger Essentials 8/10, NRMC 10/11,
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Re: Helwan Brigadier 9mm

Post by Claymore on April 1st 2014, 2:47 am

RRCmdrBennett wrote:Safe to shoot or no?

I believe so.

Stay away from +P ammo, and watch the part of the slide where there is not a lot of metal. Some of the Army's early Model 92's developed cracks in the Slide and Frame:

http://www.ar15.com/mobile/topic.html?b=5&f=15&t=101362

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Re: Helwan Brigadier 9mm

Post by Phillip Gross on April 1st 2014, 5:26 am

I don't even shoot +P in my Ruger LC9 (it says not to) because it's a lightweight gun.

Is +P OK to shoot in my S&W 6906?
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Re: Helwan Brigadier 9mm

Post by RRCmdrBennett on April 1st 2014, 10:21 am

Phillip Gross wrote:I don't even shoot +P in my Ruger LC9 (it says not to) because it's a lightweight gun.

Is +P OK to shoot in my S&W 6906?

Ruger LC's are small pocket pistols I wouldn't expect it to handle +P ammo. The NRA instructor at the last ccw class I audited taught that pistols that come with only 1 mag are backup guns. Two mag guns are primary. 

My Springfield Armory XDm can handle +P+ ammo. In 5.25" size it is a competition pistol. 

Philip, what does your owner's manual say.

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"Be Ready, It wasn't raining when Noah built the Ark."

fire FCF Frontiersman 9/91 fire
Free Trapper 2016
Training Seminars/Camps:
LTC LMA 5/94, Ranger Basics 1/05, LTA LMA 5/05, NTC IL 5/09, WCO 10/09, ICS 4/10, RKTC 7/10, Ranger Essentials 8/10, NRMC 10/11,
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Re: Helwan Brigadier 9mm

Post by Phillip Gross on April 1st 2014, 10:50 am

It says DO NOT USE +P AMMO  Very Happy 
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Re: Helwan Brigadier 9mm

Post by Claymore on April 1st 2014, 12:10 pm

Phillip Gross wrote:

Is +P OK to shoot in my S&W 6906?

http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-wesson-semi-auto-pistols/108795-help-my-6906-a.html

"S&W's official stance is no +P in the alloy models,...."

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Re: Helwan Brigadier 9mm

Post by Claymore on April 1st 2014, 2:06 pm

RRCmdrBennett wrote:A coworker got this Helwan Brigadier 9mm from his dad. Best I can determine its aBeretta  knock-off. Anyone know the quality of this gun?

Dan, I've been doing some research, and it looks like some Helwans tend to beat themselves to death.

The first thing that I would do is to put in the beefiest Recoil Spring that would work (in order to cushion the slide whacking the frame during operation).  It looks like the springs for the Beretta Model 92 will NOT interchange.  Someone indicated that the spring for a Centurion may fit.  I don't know.

Maybe if he contacted Wolf Springs, they could tell him.

By the way, the Commercial Names for this model were Beretta Brigadier and Beretta Model 1951.




http://forums.gunboards.com/showthread.php?103000-9MM-Helwan

"At least some of these made for export Helwans essentially self destruct due to bad metallurgy. Personally, I suspect almost all of them are bad. Certainly the problem is serious enough to make the risk of firing one not worth taking. Watch the locking block, all locking surfaces, and the area of the slide in the locking cut areas for deformation if you insist on taking this risk. The genuine Mil-Spec Helwans are fine, but those made for export aparently are not. Mine was clearly little used when I got it, seemed fine, but beat itself into uselessness after 50 rounds. I have no doubt that the gun was less than 50 rounds away from a catastrophic failure and severe personal injury to myself at that time. The steel is butter soft. "

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Re: Helwan Brigadier 9mm

Post by RRCmdrBennett on April 1st 2014, 8:32 pm

Phillip Gross wrote:It says DO NOT USE +P AMMO  Very Happy 
I was referring to the 6906 question you asked.

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Sr Commander (2007-2016)
N Central Area Communications Coord, CI (2016)
RR Outpost #215, Ohio District :flag:
RR GMA #83 Potomac Dist-#2366 Nat'l

"Be Ready, It wasn't raining when Noah built the Ark."

fire FCF Frontiersman 9/91 fire
Free Trapper 2016
Training Seminars/Camps:
LTC LMA 5/94, Ranger Basics 1/05, LTA LMA 5/05, NTC IL 5/09, WCO 10/09, ICS 4/10, RKTC 7/10, Ranger Essentials 8/10, NRMC 10/11,
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Re: Helwan Brigadier 9mm

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